So What You’re Saying is Our Apportionment Dollars Are Paying Counselors from Liberty University to Work at United Methodist Camps in North Carolina? No Thank You.

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Misinformation

When I read this, I felt sad for Reverend Bryant in that he is placed in God's work on a beautiful island yet he writes publicly and online about the travails of such a place. In contrast, I know a few Liberty University students (and am in fact interviewing some right now for business jobs), and what I've seen is students who recognize that God is present in every situation, in every part of their lives, even if they are placed on a remote island. The Liberty students I've met and know are people who understand the need to demonstrate the love of Christ in real, tangible ways. Liberty students volunteer many hours each week both when they are enrolled in school and as a habit after they graduate. I personally have seen natural grace, unconditional love, and unending peace from Liberty students. When I asked why, they explained it is because this is what the Bible asks us to do.

I challenge you to know your facts, do some research, make a visit to the school, and do some interviews before you cast judgment on people you do not know.

Anita J 112 days ago

"Them!?"

A tacky sci-fi movie of the 1950s, warning of giant killer ants spawned by nukes, had the cheerful title of "Them." Well, thanks to this article we now know who fits the bill as "Them" for our inclusive church.

Consider the closing lines: "As we journey toward the dark heart of this present eschaton, we’re going to head nod our way into oblivion." OK, Falwell Jr is worse than Falwell Sr in my book. And I would not recommend students go to Liberty ... but I also noticed Liberty students who protested Trump's presence, took public stands criticizing Falwell for his prophet as lapdog attitude toward Trump. Any college age counselor who fails screening should not be hired, but to stereotype and blanket exclude students denies their own integrity.

Harvard is Unitarian, and that's on a good day; the Divinity School moved its baccalaureate service out of Memorial Church lest conducting it there be exclusionary to non or anti-Christian graduates ... for which the late blessed Rev. Peter Gomes raked leadership over the coals. Given Harvard's spiritual track record, I suppose students from that school also are to be excluded, a priori? Not everyone accepted to Harvard did/does so because they bought the party line, and not just yours truly ... automatic exclusion OR inclusion by virtue of attending any school would be the real shame.

Bob 112 days ago

Liberty counslers

Evidently Rev. Bryant needs a little education on scripture and the discipline. No where in either is the GLBT lifestyle approved or endorsed. As a pastor, I would have the same misgivings he has if the consoler did not give the biblical and historical teaching on same sex issues. I would object to, say, a United Church of Christ young adult as a worker in our camps

Win Scott 112 days ago

Not Just No, but H...you know the rest

Sorry, but "No." Apparently, there are no Methodist Schools from whence to recruit. It's about the significant differences in theological perspective but it also seems to say that Methodist college students aren't "religious" or mature enough. Who thought this was OK?

John Masters 112 days ago

So, you're not a traditionalist

Sir,
There are far worse things than hiring Camp Counselors from Liberty University. Maybe you missed the article put out by one of the many gay students from LU who found love and acceptance at Liberty University. Matter of fact, his professors begged him not to quit school, but he chose to quit attending LU and then came back to the school and graduated from Liberty.

What you may not know is that LU has one of the largest LGBTQA+ communities of any college, not because they want to shake up the school, but because they are accepted as they are, where they are in their walk with Christ. Even I attended LU as a practicing member of a Jewish Synagogue and found acceptance for my beliefs.

Yes, Jerry Falwell, Jr. is outspoken on BIBLICAL standards, which supersede the BOOK OF DISCIPLINE (believe it or not). Deal with it. Embrace students from Liberty, actually get to know them, find out what their exact beliefs are. Oh, and maybe read these two articles. https://www.theatlantic.com/sexes/archive/2013/04/being-gay-at-jerry-falwells-university/274578/ and http://wset.com/archive/coming-out-at-liberty-university-the-story-of-one-gay-lu-grad

Then maybe, just maybe you can judge Liberty University, the staff and those counselors you refuse to get to know or give a chance to. I find it funny that just in May of 2017 you said "You were a traditionalist." in a post here, and today, you are a progressive. .Do forgive me, Reverend, but can you really have it both ways? Can you really throw away our traditional teachings and embrace hatred? I wonder, often what John Wesley would think if he saw the current standing of our church and I wonder, sir, if he would not give those students/counselors from LU a chance to continue to grow.

For the rest of you who, like this gentleman, who have no understanding of what LU actually teaches, I will tell you it is FAR from Jerry Falwell, Jr.'s current standing. As a matter of fact, I came out of LU (twice) with more parched with thirst for the God I now serve, believe it or not with more understanding of amy homosexual friends, and more acceptance towards their choices. I know you may all think that this crazy that they use counselors from LU, but honestly, you won't find what you think you will -- closed-minded people. The centrist movement in the UMC wants to cry out for tolerance, yet you won't even allow for students from Liberty to come and grow in their faith. Everyone wants to be a liberal or centrist until their feet are stepped on

RA 112 days ago

Selective outrage

My kids have been to camps where there have been many Liberty University students on staff. Your concerns are without merit, reflecting instead your own knee-jerk biases.

Ask yourself why you don't like evangelicals when, in reality, it is progressives like yourself who stand outside the mainstream of Wesleyan and UMC doctrine and history. Reread our Articles of Religion, and try to tell me that you agree with them in full using the exact same meanings of every word as John Wesley intended when they were written/edited. Agreeing with our doctrine only by reinterpreting their meaning to fit your own beliefs may ease your conscience when you took your vows, but understand that, to those who do agree with our doctrines as written and in their original intent, your approach to our doctrine is viewed as an exercise in self-deception at best, or dishonesty at worst.

Also, there are many UMC students attending Liberty. I would assume that many of these students are more theologically conservative than you would be comfortable with, but that's beside the point.

Also, you need to get out more; I am quite familiar with the Southern Baptists and they are far more understanding of those who struggle with sexual sin and sexual identity issues than you give them credit for. The SBC view is virtually the same as what is contained in our BoD! Many SBC members can wholeheartedly endorse all of the UMC doctrinal standards without having to reinterpret the meaning of anything!

I'd be infinitely more comfortable with a camp counselor who consistently points the kids to Christ and does not shy away from calling sin sin, then a progressive counselor who tells the kids just to love and accept everyone. I want the kids to come back from camp with a strengthened belief and faith, not having been turned into mini-progressives even more confused about their faith.

Paul W. 112 days ago

As a conservative

I also struggle with exactly where my apportionment dollars are going! When I joined The United Methodist Church as an adult and promised to uphold it with my prayers, presence, gifts, service and witness, it was with the understanding that I was supporting a single, unique faith tradition that shared some overall beliefs with other faith traditions but at the same time possessed beliefs that were unique to it. I now know that I am part of a church that has theologically become like water spilled on the floor trying to go multiple directions at once! It is no wonder that a lifetime of being a good church-going Methodist/United Methodist left me in a spiritual never never land. The church's problem is not sexuality, the church's problem is it collectively has no idea of who it is, what it believes about anything and what it is it needs to be doing! And I am supposed to support this mess?

Betsy 112 days ago

Echoing Your No

Please tell me you objected openly, immediately, loudly. I swear, every prospective, current, retired member of UMC clergy and every employee at every level needs to be required to read Living Our Beliefs and then be tested on it. It's like no one has a clue who we are as Methodists and we're undergoing an invasion of "E"vangelical thought-bots.

Valerie Ohle 112 days ago

Hiring counselors from Liberty

I am sure that Liberty students' mothers love them and they mean well, but the toxic environment and distorted theology they absorb contradicts the informed faith of most United Methodist Christians. I too am shocked and saddened to hear our camps are recruiting folks who will misinform and confuse campers.

TrueBluePT 113 days ago

Liberty U

Thank you for speaking up. Methodists should be at our camps. There are too many who don’t teach the love and compassion of Jesus.

Marilyn Davis 113 days ago

Counselors from Liberty University

Would the counselors from Liberty University say something different that the UM Book of Discipline? "We affirm that all persons are individuals of sacred worth, created in the image of God. All persons need the ministry of the Church in their struggles for human fulfillment, as well as the spiritual and emotional care of a fellowship that enables reconciling relationships with God, with others, and with self. The United Methodist Church does not condone the practice of homosexuality and considers this practice incompatible with Christian teaching. We affirm that God’s grace is available to all. We will seek to live together in Christian community, welcoming, forgiving, and loving one another, as Christ has loved and accepted us. We implore families and churches not to reject or condemn lesbian and gay members and friends. We commit ourselves to be in ministry for and with all persons."

Barbara Pesch 113 days ago

Considering...

...that their college was founded by a segregationist as a "segregationist academy" though they admit African-Americans now as long as they are politically correct it is doubtful that those schooled at a place where bigotry is policy would mirror the good parts of that, just the bad part.

George Nixon Shuler 112 days ago

Councelors from liberty university

Yes, the counselor from Liberty University could communicate and reflect the racism that the school has endorsed.

Nora Colmenares 111 days ago

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