What the Hell Kind of Country Do We Live In? (Part 2)

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Two points

One: There is not one shed of evidence that the deaths of Michael Brown and Eric Garner were the result of racism. Two: While torture is abhorrent, so is flying airplanes into buildings and killing nearly 3,000 innocent people. It's easy to sit here 13 years after 9/11 and criticize what was done but in the aftermath, when anxiety levels and fears of another attack were high, I'm not sure the answer is quite so simple.

DW more than 2 years ago

A Moral Crisis

Cynthia Astle, I salute you. Torture is wrong. Whether Iran or China or the United States does it, it is wrong. Once one gets the mind around that, the side arguments disappear. It does not matter whether those on the receiving end of the torture were guilty or innocent. We have in place due processes of justice to punish the guilty, and we owe repentance and restitution to those who were innocent. It distresses me that many of those we tortured had nothing to do with 9/11; one such man I name here, Khalid al-Masri, a German citizen who was picked up by the CIA on an apparent case of mistaken identity. His life was ruined by the brutality inflicted on him. Eric Garner and Michael Brown were victims of violence generated by institutional racism as public policy. I have read and listened to commentary on both torture and police brutality, and I fear that although we have more Christians than any other nation, our basic morality and our ability to engage in moral reasoning are in deep trouble.

Ann Locasio more than 2 years ago

National idendity

Hands up don't shoot is an urban myth perpetuated by people trying to paint a vicious thug as a martyr. The interrogation techniques while repugnant are understandable given the circumstances. The fact that we can openly debate this topic tells us what kind of country we are part of and I am proud of that. I remember as a young Navy officer making a port call to an unstable part of the world and how the local Americans there greeted us and told us how reassuring it was to see their flag flying over the ship. Some of them moved to tears because they knew their country was watching out for them.

"the disgust, despair, and fear we now know as our true national identity" and with these words Ms. Astle reveals her identity. I do indeed feel disgust. Almost enough to make me vomit.

Kevin more than 2 years ago

Fascist leaning?

Are you serious? I suggest you review the events of 9-11-01. Take a look at the videos of planes crashing into buildings. Look at photos of people jumping from the twin towers to keep from being burned alive. Look at the fires at the Pentagon and listen to the tapes of people calling from United flight 93 to tell their families good-bye. Nearly 3,000 innocent people killed just because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. While am not necessarily excusing everything that was done, if you are going to talk about horrendous, you need to start there.

DW more than 2 years ago

Notable Quotes


Brian McLaren"All of us, especially people of faith, need to proclaim that white supremacy and white privilege and all other forms of racism and injustice must indeed be replaced with something better – the beloved community where all are welcome, all are safe, and all are free. White supremacist and Nazi dreams of apartheid must be replaced with a better dream – people of all tribes, races, creeds, and nations learning to live in peace, mutual respect, and neighborliness. Such a better world is possible, but only if we set our hearts on realizing the possibility."

– Brian McLaren, writing in "What I Saw in Charlottesville" on the Auburn Seminary website.


"The idea of racial (or most any other) supremacy is antithetical to that Gospel. We should remember that Jesus himself grasped for no superiority, no rank, but instead made himself a servant, giving himself in love. What we saw in Charlottesville was therefore a kind of anti-gospel, something that must be resisted, yes–but more, something that must be overcome."

– Dr. Craig Hill, dean of United Methodist-related Perkins School of Theology, Southern Methodist University, on Facebook.

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