Court Ruling Prompts GC2019 Plan Revisions

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Wouldn’t any “Traditional” plan cause some release of long-time employees? Hello law suits!

I may be “traditional” Methodist, but I see a “Traditional Plan” as a legal minefield: Will a homosexual clergy who has been allowed by his/her church, bishops, conference and the Judicial Council to be a UMC clergy for years, but suddenly losing a job based on a new Traditional Plan, if approved, file suit for job discrimination? I sure would!
To employ a person for years knowing full well they did not conform to the rules, but ignoring the rules creates a “precedent”. It would be like over-turning Roe v. Wade after 40 years. In law, bad things that are allowed to go on and on and on suddenly become acceptable by precedent. Wouldn’t strict adherence to a Traditional plan have to mean some staff impacts or it would be nothing different than what we have now?
So, to say to UMC homosexual employees that they are out, I believe, will drag UMC churches into state courts all over America, and through the federal system. Do you, my fellow traditionalists, want to spend gazillion$ in attorney fee$ to prove firing a long-time homosexual employee is not discrimination?
Not I! That’s why I support the “Split n’ Git” Plan. Let’s hold a nice funeral for the UMC and each side move on with our lives.

Reese more than 2 years ago

Court battles

Could happen but our court system is usually reluctant to get involved with internal church disputes. You do point out the big hurdle with the Traditionalist Plan. It will require stern measures to drive out disobedient pastors because they are not simply going to walk away.

Kevin more than 2 years ago

Oh sir, but in our new world of activist, liberal courts, greedy lawyers, and

states like Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New Jersey, Washington, Oregon, Hawaii, and California, plus the 9th circuit, I must assume that a few test cases (remember: lawyers get 40% of the winnings) would lead to a few financial rewards which, like cancer, would then spread quickly by lawyers riding "precedents". When it comes to lawyers, courts and liberals, ALWAYS believe the worst!

Reese more than 2 years ago

court battles

of course the lawyers always win. The Episcopal Church proved that. I am no lawyer but I doubt if the 9th Circuit would get involved. That is a Federal Court. Real estate law goes state by state. A ruling in one state has no bearing in another.

Kevin more than 2 years ago

My warning is about Discrimination in Emploment, not realestate

At the bottom line, the Traditionalists plans call for enforcing the BOD as it stands. That cannot be done without dismissing some openly homosexual employees. They are not to take that laying down. I'm no lawyer, but I know the challenges I once faced in business and it does not take much to get sued.

Reese more than 2 years ago


How exactly do they even enforce this if multiple conferences simply ignore the Traditional Plan? Its not like the few that are pushing this have enough clout to force the issue even. And what do they do if the pew sitters rise up and refuse to go along. They can't possibly throw out hundreds of thousands of members. No what will happen is like the PCA and ELCA they renewal congregations will leave and form their own denomination with a little financial support from the UMC to help the problem go away and we will move on. But I find this unneeded persecution of minorities reminiscent of the 1950's. It is wrong, unjust, and un Christ like. There is nothing biblical in any of this.

eric pone more than 2 years ago

Indeed! Multiple conferences will ignore the Traditional, and multiple will ignore any capitulation to progressives

It is a shame that UMC leadership defiantly ignores what is obvious to me, and I think, you, Mr. Pone: There is no middle ground, no compromise, no rules to pass that ALL will follow. St. Louis is a complete waste of time and money. How many are sent on a fools errand, to negotiate the non-negotiable?
We do not agree, however, that there is persecution at UMC. We Methodists have had traditions and beliefs that go back to our beginnings. Those were put into writing around 50 years ago to insure that our old rules were clear. Homosexuals have made their own choices to join our denomination with those traditions and rules in place. Homosexuals have had alternatives. They were not forced to join UMC. If you are not trapped, imprisoned or forced to join something that is counter to your needs, you are NOT being persecuted. Perhaps there are isolated back-water churches which have not been welcoming to homosexuals, but all I have been in have welcomed all to our pews, our communions, our classes. For me to refuse to accept a homosexual as a spiritual leader or accept a wedding which is insulting to my beliefs is not persecution of anyone, it is based on centuries of my traditions, based on the leadership and teachings of some very Christian people.

Reese more than 2 years ago

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