The Rev. Dr. Gregory S. Neal (right) and his spouse, Kade Rogers, launched a new podcast, "The Inclusive Faith," to tackle the difficult questions people want to ask about religion but afraid to bring up in church. (Photo Courtesy of The Inclusive Faith)
A United Methodist Insight Exclusive | May 26, 2026
Their conversation began around the dinner table, a gay married couple in ministry pondering the mysteries of faith and life. Now their conversations have gone public in a podcast they hope will inspire United Methodists and other spiritual seekers to discuss the deep, uncomfortable questions many may find unwelcome in church.
“The Inclusive Faith” podcast launched May 26, hosted by the Rev. Dr. Gregory S. Neal and his spouse, Kade Rogers. Dr. Neal is senior pastor of Grace United Methodist Church in Des Moines, Iowa, where Mr. Rogers is director of communications and also serves as director of ministry at a related new-church start, Southside Church and Community Center.
Their podcast grows out of their struggles both as gay men and as ministers seeking to help people find faith in Jesus Christ that brings hope, community and strength for daily living in an often-hostile world. In fact, they say, their struggles for acceptance of their marriage and as gay men in ministry have opened them to the similar-but-different struggles of all people, especially young people.
Their public witness began with their 2022 wedding in Dallas, Texas. Because The United Methodist Church outlawed same-sex weddings at that time, Dr. Neal was brought up on charges in the then-North Texas Annual Conference. Despite support from the eight Reconciling Ministry Network congregations in Dallas, they faced painful backlash and rejection. The experience led Dr. Neal to transfer to the Iowa Annual Conference, which despite encompassing a traditional agricultural community has been a UMC leader in social justice. Dr. Neal was appointed to Grace UMC, a Des Moines congregation with a long history of social justice ministry that was “absolutely delighted” to receive them, said Dr. Neal.
With such a context, they hope that “The Inclusive Faith” will be a pathway to faith for their audience, they said in an online interview with United Methodist Insight.
“We were having conversations that I felt sure others in religious circles were having,” said Mr. Rogers. “I thought we should have these conversations in public for people to witness.”
Dr. Neal added: “We wanted to speak from our own experience as out queer people serving in ministry in a mainline church. Our LGBTQ issues are important but they’re not all our focus.”
Mr. Rogers agreed. “We want to ask people what’s on their minds, how is it with your soul? We want to take church beyond the sanctuary walls to meet people where they are.”
After getting feedback on the podcast’s pilot from friends and colleagues, they’ve already recorded 13 episodes which they’re releasing every other week and are planning a second season for the fall. They’re being distributed through most major podcast platforms and in video on YouTube.
Dr. Neal and Mr. Rogers said they start the series by telling their own faith stories. For example, there’s an episode in which Mr. Rogers, who grew up in a theologically conservative church in Oklahoma, talks about his struggle with reading the Bible literally. In another episode, Dr. Neal discusses going through “gay conversion” therapy as a young man, a topic that he also covers in his new book, “Suspended Grace: A Queer Pastor’s Journey” coming from the UMC’s Abingdon Press in November.
Other episodes focus on topics such as Christian nationalism, the idea of “the rapture,” heaven and hell, and the “clobber passages” in scripture regarding homosexuality.
“We turned the lighting backdrop to red for the ‘hell’ episode,” laughed Dr. Neal.
One topic that especially concerns Mr. Rogers involves the church “overpromising” benefits from spiritual practice.
“The church promises too much, especially to young people,” said Mr. Rogers. “The church says, ‘if you walk in the door all your troubles will be gone, God will take away all your pain.’ That’s not true, and the church does people a disservice by overpromising, especially when it leads people into toxic faith and toxic congregations that end up doing harm.”
“It’s dangerous to tell people [spirituality] will solve all your problems; some might actually believe that, but I think it’s done to manipulate,” he added.
Both men acknowledged there are risks involved with “The Inclusive Church,” some from the tender topics they’re tackling and some from hatred toward them as gay men.
“Young people are deeply untrusting of institutions, but we see they’re still spiritual; they want to change the world,” said Mr. Rogers. “We should be able to talk about these things and not be perfect people; there are things Greg and I don’t agree on.
“People who’ve been hurt by the church, LGBTQ people, are afraid, even of Greg and I,” Mr. Rogers added. “It’s the air of judgment that gets attached to Christianity that we’re trying to address.”
Dr. Neal concurred. “It’s hard to do what we’re doing and not feel like we’re in the spotlight; we’re being watched.”
Like most LGBTQ+ people in today’s “heightened political world” as Dr. Neal calls it, the couple refuse to let threats of physical violence keep them from witnessing.
“We’ve had death threats in mail and phone calls,” said Mr. Rogers. “Every time we do something public, I think, “is today the day when the hate comes out?’ I’m absolutely not going to let it silence me.”
Dr. Neal said Grace UMC “has taken extraordinary steps to ensure security” for the men and their parishioners, including installing cameras and motion sensors that monitor the church’s public areas. In addition, Iowa Conference Bishop Kennetha Bigham-Tsai asked to be informed of any threats the couple receive and has supported them when such have occured.
“I draw courage from Kade and being able to be true to who and what I am,” Dr. Neal said. “I’m not going to live my life in hiding. I did that for decades as a young kid and as a minister. I came out of the closet and I can’t go back.”
Even with their specific views as gay men in ministry, Mr. Rogers and Dr. Neal stressed they’re striving to make “The Inclusive Faith” a place for “church people left, right, and center and also people outside the church.” Mr. Rogers acknowledged their podcast must overcome today’s negative reputation of Christianity and the church.
“My understanding of church was negative,” said Mr. Rogers. “Because of my sexual identity struggle, church wasn’t a safe place for me.
“I never imagined that I would be starting a podcast about faith and life and be the voice that I needed when I was a little boy.”
The Inclusive Faith Podcast is available wherever you listen to podcasts, with full video episodes also available on YouTube. The show can be followed on social media at @theinclusivefaith, with community resources and additional information available at theinclusivefaith.com.
Cynthia B. Astle serves as Editor of United Methodist Insight, which she founded in 2011 as a media channel to amplify news and views about, by and for marginalized and under-served United Methodists.