Historian: Potential UMC Split Ignores Questions of Doctrine

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Wrong

The current divorce proceedings has to do with the disregard with the rule of law.

That along with the cowards in leaderships especially the bishops who have refused to enforce The Discipline evenly and fairly across the connexion.

Doctrine, theology, practice, etc have nothing to do with our current situation

Richard F Hicks more than 1 year ago

Source of Authority

The BOD is not the source of authority of John Wesley or the Methodist Church. JW and The BOD both defer to the bible on theological and plain worded items for guidance. No matter what the church thinks, it still has to defer to the bible and its not up for debate. We can throw all sorts of words at it and it won't make the prohibition any less clear.

Brian Evers more than 1 year ago

Doctrine

Taking Wesley's words about marrying at their own discretion as approval of same sex marriage is a reach. If Dr. Lawrence was really concerned about Methodist doctrine he should have brought this up years ago. Now it simply sounds like pointless whining.

Kevin more than 1 year ago

Maybe

I agree that Wesley wouldn't have approved of same sex marriage.

But he's also saying that it's not the place of the Methodist Church to tell pastors if they should or should not get married (and yet, the Discipline now says exactly that - being in a same sex marriage is verboten).

So there's a conflict, and there's no way to resolve that conflict because the UMC has no body of authority to resolve that issue.

JR more than 1 year ago

Wrong

Article VI states "Although the law given from God by Moses as touching ceremonies and rites doth not bind Christians, nor ought the civil precepts thereof of necessity be received in any commonwealth; yet notwithstanding, no Christian whatsoever is free from the obedience of the commandments which are called moral."

Now, this historian should be well aware of John Wesley's definition of the moral law which, from a doctrinal perspective, drives a stake through the heart of his argument and exposes it as mere sophistry.

Paul W. more than 1 year ago

Ok, let's walk through it

"yet notwithstanding, no Christian whatsoever is free from the obedience of the commandments which are called moral."

Which ones are we talking about?
The commandment of Jesus that no one should be divorced? (Matthew 19, which conflicts with OT rules)
The commandment that homosexuals should be killed (Leviticus 20:13)? Compared to not stoning (John 8)?
Human trafficking, charging interest on loans, talking back to your parents, etc etc.

Which ones of those are the 'moral' commandments that we have to follow, and who made you the 'deciderer' for the UMC?

JR more than 1 year ago